Russian Misinformashun!
que the "putin bot".
Say what you want about "interference" in 2014 Ukraine overthrow, but it's not like we had much to do with it. the people did that. It's not like we dropped little green men in there, overthrew the place by force and then held fake elections since then.
There were riots in Ukraine because the pro-Russian leader went back on his word (and the vote) to integrate more with Europe, and instead decided to hitch up to Russia
So the people were demonstrating in the streets. The government started killing them.
Fuck Russia.
We might have supported what went on, but it was happening anyway. Russia can't accept that a border state might want to have a free will away from Russia
I'm sick of people telling me that Russia has a legitimate reason to invade Ukraine.
Russia even gave multiple bullshit and conflicting reasons for the invasion. Putin gave a full of shit history monolog to that giggling fool, Tucker.
Fuck Russia
Say what you want about "interference" in 2014 Ukraine overthrow, but it's not like we had much to do with it. the people did that. It's not like we dropped little green men in there, overthrew the place by force and then held fake elections since then.
Actually, we had a very lot to do with it. IF you read the article, they document how we basically paid for it, picked the leaders and guided it.
There were riots in Ukraine because the pro-Russian leader went back on his word (and the vote) to integrate more with Europe, and instead decided to hitch up to Russia
Again, if you read it, that's not quite it.
"The reality was more complex. Yanukovych was hoping to maintain relations with both Russia and Europe – and use competition between them to Ukraine’s advantage. He also worried that the EU’s terms, which demanded reduced trade with Russia, would alienate his political base in the east and south, home to millions of ethnic Russians. As the International Crisis Group noted, these Yanukovych-supporting Ukrainians feared that the EU terms “would hurt their livelihoods, a large number of which were tied to trade and close relations with Russia.” Despite claims that the Maidan movement represented a “popular revolution,” polls from that period showed that Ukrainians were evenly split on it, or even majority opposed."
So the people were demonstrating in the streets. The government started killing them.
I think there's significant conflicting information on that:
"That winter was marked by a series of escalating clashes. On February 20, 2014, snipers fatally shot dozens of protesters in Maidan square. Western governments attributed the killings to Yanukovych's forces. But an intercepted phone call between NATO officials told a different story.
In the recorded conversation, Estonian foreign minister Urmas Paet told EU foreign secretary Catherine Ashton that he believed pro-Maidan forces were behind the slaughter. In Kyiv, Paet reported, “there is now stronger and stronger understanding that behind the snipers, it was not Yanukovych, but it was somebody from the new [opposition] coalition.”
Fuck Russia.
Well, at least we agree on that in general.
We might have supported what went on, but it was happening anyway. Russia can't accept that a border state might want to have a free will away from Russia
The article makes it pretty clear it could not have happened without our support.
"In violation of parliamentary rules on impeachment proceedings, and lacking a sufficient quorum, Oleksandr Turchynov was named the new acting president. The Nuland-backed Yatsenyuk was appointed Prime Minister.
Ben Rhodes, top Obama aide: Wrote in his memoir that Nuland and Pyatt “sounded as if they were picking a new government.”
In a reflection of their influence, at least five post-coup cabinet posts in national security, defense, and law enforcement were given to members of Svoboda and its far-right ally Right Sector.
“The uncomfortable truth is that a sizeable portion of Kyiv’s current government – and the protesters who brought it to power – are, indeed, fascists,” wrote Andrew Foxall, now a British defense official, and Oren Kessler, a Tel Aviv-based analyst, in Foreign Policy" Which, however incredible it is, seems to support both Boroda's and Putin's allegations about Nazis in Ukrainian government.
I'm sick of people telling me that Russia has a legitimate reason to invade Ukraine.
That's not what the article is saying. The article, to me, is saying that the US government, from it's Oval Office, Congress and Deep State Departments Of is totally corrupt and out of control. Further, that the US is primarily responsible for the disaster that is Ukraine. The US shaped it and funded it, along with GEORGE SOROS. That Soros involvement should be a huge red flag to everyone.
"In 2012, one pro-Maidan group, Center UA, received most of its more than $500,000 in donations from the U.S. Agency for International Development (USAID), the National Endowment for Democracy, eBay founder Pierre Omidyar, and financier George Soros.
Jeffrey Sachs: "They were describing to me: ‘Oh we paid for this, we paid for that. We funded this insurrection.’ It turned my stomach.”
By its own count, Soros’ International Renaissance Foundation spent over $109 million in Ukraine between 2004 and 2014. In leaked documents, a former IRF board member even bragged that its partners “were the main driving force and the foundation of the Maidan movement,” and that without Soros’ funding, “the revolution might not have succeeded.” Weeks after the coup, an IRF strategy document noted, “Like during the Maidan protests, IRF representatives are in the midst of Ukraine’s transition process.”
I can't see anyone supporting something Soros funded.
So this is the one time in history that the United States successfully installed a puppet government and there was no unrest in the country afterward.
Everything went perfectly and everybody loves The new government that we forced upon them.
Great read Toad. Thanks.
So this is the one time in history that the United States successfully installed a puppet government and there was no unrest in the country afterward.
Everything went perfectly and everybody loves The new government that we forced upon them.
It wasn't perfect. The Donbass broke away and started a civil cold war where they traded the occasional indirect fire along the front but there weren't armored assaults. Remember the videos of guys just walking out and standing in front of Ukrainian BMPs daring them to run them over? Donbass broke away quite handily because it contained the majority that favored Russia.
Read your post Toad. I just KNEW George Soros' fingerprints would appear...
What I'm saying was that that revolution started and happened on its own.
That's evidenced by how they're fighting for their country right now. They have the government that they want and that they wanted. They overthrew the government that they didn't want that was lying to them and moving them in the opposite direction they wanted to go.
I don't care if we supported them. We probably did but we in no way orchestrated an overthrow of the government and then carried it out. That's ridiculous.
And I know it's more about meddling in other countries affairs. Who doesn't do that? I don't care if we did or not. I'm glad we did. Help them. Just like the French helped us.
It's been happening throughout history and it will continue to happen.
Just because Russia doesn't like it doesn't mean we shouldn't do it. Fuck Russia up the ass.
In other words, I don't care what Russia likes or doesn't like about what's going on in another country. They have no right to have invaded and what we did doesn't give them the right to invade.
Russia is invading Ukraine because they don't like the government in Ukraine. Plain and simple. It's not because we meddled.
Son-of-a-BITCH! Obama's fingerprints are there as well!
You can keep rewinding. There's speeches of Bush advocating for Ukraine in NATO in 2008.
Putin opened the door to the Clintons personally. They're USAID scammers, that's what the Clinton Foundation is built for. It's a money funnel from government aid bills and US-made requirements through private industry that bankrolls them. Now that Russia has created a huge need for aid in Ukraine, the USAID is flowing, and Hillary is good friends with the First Lady of Ukraine.
It wasn't perfect. The Donbass broke away and started a civil cold war where they traded the occasional indirect fire along the front but there weren't armored assaults. Remember the videos of guys just walking out and standing in front of Ukrainian BMPs daring them to run them over? Donbass broke away quite handily because it contained the majority that favored Russia.
There was a strong Russian influence on the Donbass civil war of 2014. There were thousands of Russians such as FSB colonel Igor Girkin who showed up as "little green men" and agitators. Polling before the Maidan in Donbass was low twenty precent in favor of joining Russia and the higher numbers magically appeared after the Russians rolled in. Once the conflict broke out the little green men received direct support from Russian units which turned the tide from a Uke winning to a stalemate.
What would be the quickest way to end this? Tell Zelensky to give them Donbass and call it quits?
What would be the quickest way to end this? Tell Zelensky to give them Donbass and call it quits?
Putin and Russian state media have always said that UA is actually Russia and anyone who disagrees is a Nazis and needs to accept that or die. Why would you think we call the shots for the Ukes? They are their own country of over 40 million people who have their own agency. Why would you think that Putin would just stop at Donbass if he thinks he has the capital to keep going?
In my view the only way you stop aggression is to make it clear that it won't be worth the risk. What this admin has done is the worst possible path of half measures way to late.
And why would anyone think that RUSSIA gets to call the shots in Ukraine?
I'm all for UK and Russia duking it out... just don't use my tax dollars to do it. Not my monkeys not my circus.
Touch a NATO country and all bets are off though. As much as I think NATO should have been shit canned after the USSR fell, we are obligated to respond.
As long as Putin is in office none of the former SSR satellites are safe...
